CNN International TV channel’s The Connect World program broadcast interview with President Ilham Aliyev

On October 9, The Connect World program of CNN International TV channel has broadcast an interview with President of the Republic of Azerbaijan Ilham Aliyev.

Report presents the interview.

-Sir, I spoke to the President of Armenia, and he told me that this conflict is dramatically different from the previous clashes because of the open support that Turkey is providing Azerbaijan. Specifically, he told me this. With its military officials, generals, mercenaries, and terroristic jihadists, Turkey brought in thousands to Azerbaijan to fight Nagorno-Karabakh. Turkey, with its military, might pretend they are there to protect some international logistic structures. Are there any Turkish forces or Turkish equipment in Azerbaijan right now, sir?

-Turkish equipment, yes, Turkish forces no. And frankly speaking, I regret that the Armenian president is using this opportunity to address the world through CNN to spread rumors. I cannot call it otherwise because what he said as you presented to me I didn't see his presentation but what I heard from you is wrong. It is false information. Turkey is supporting us, but this is political support. This is diplomatic support, and if not for this support, if not for the very open position of the Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan saying that Azerbaijan is not alone, Turkey is with Azerbaijan, probably today Armenia would have achieved its goal, which is actually to spread the geography of this conflict and to involve as many countries as possible, so these countries help them on the battlefield. And I would also like to remind the Armenian president who was behind Armenia when Armenia was occupying our territories at the beginning of the 90s. We have enough evidence of who was helping them to invade our areas. Therefore, from the Armenian side to say that somebody is helping Azerbaijan is absolutely wrong is false information, and we reject it.

-You have said that there is Turkish equipment in Azerbaijan. What Turkish equipment, sir?

-Weapons, Turkish weapons, not only Turkish weapons, Russian weapons, Israeli weapons, Belarusian weapons, Ukrainian weapons, you name it. Today, the geography of our purchases of military equipment is getting broader and broader, and we pay for that. If you look at how Armenia gets their weapons and from where you will see that they could not afford to pay for those weapons which they have because that's billions of dollars. For a developing country, it's impossible. They get weapons-free of charge from their ally; we get weapons paying for them.

-Okay, let me put this to you, sir. We have seen satellite imagery that would suggest Turkish F-16s are on at least one of your bases. You haven't bought F-16s. So, is that correct? Are there F-16s on the ground that would suggest significant support for Azerbaijan?

-I agree with you when you say on the ground. F-16s came to Azerbaijan for a military exercise. Last year Azerbaijan and Turkey had ten joint military exercises. Turkey is our ally, and it is common here to have military activities, including the air force. By the way, this year, due to the pandemic, we had only two military exercises. One of them was just before the Armenian attack on Azerbaijan happened. So F-16s are on the ground, they are not flying. They are not in any way participating in any kind of battle. And by the way…

-You are categorical about that. That F-16s are not in use.

-I am categorical, and even more, I want to tell you about one Armenian fake in the first days of the clashes they said that Turkish F-16 shot down Armenian SU-25. This is fake, and those who are accusing us of this now should apologize because everybody knows that this is a fake. F-16s are here, but they are on the ground, as you correctly mentioned.

-OSCE's Minsk Group, which has sought a solution to this long-standing dispute since the 1990s, is co-chaired by France, the US, and Russia. The French foreign minister has explicitly warned that Turkey's backing of Azerbaijan risks fueled this conflict's internationalization. You say you are supported by Turkey. But what do you say to the French when they say this support risks this conflict getting worse?

-I disagree with that. As I said, Turkey plays a stabilizing role in the region and, particularly, in the situation concerning the Armenia-Azerbaijan Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. Every country can afford to have a partner and an ally. And Azerbaijan and Azerbaijani people are happy to have such a partner, such as a supporter and such a brother like Turkey. We do not object when Armenia considers France their ally, and France is a country that supports Armenia most of all. At the same time, we see that it's up to countries themselves to choose allies. For instance, the French foreign minister is not concerned about Russia supporting Armenia with weapons-free of charge, and he doesn't think it is the internationalization of the conflict. But when Turkey expresses legitimate political support, it becomes a concern, and I, frankly speaking, cannot understand how one NATO country can act in such a way against another NATO country? NATO members are supposed to be allies. But we don't see it.

-Can you explicitly lay out the goals of your campaign at present?

Our goal is to defend our people, defend our country, and defend our right to live on our land. It was Armenia who, on September 27th, launched an artillery attack on the Azerbaijani military position and our villages and cities. During these days of clashes, we have 31 victims among civilians, almost 200 wounded, and more than 1,000 houses demolished or seriously damaged by the Armenian army. We had to respond, had to defend ourselves. Our response was very sensitive to Armenia, was very painful. They suffer severe defeat and run away from us. We liberate part of our territory, install our national flag on the occupied territories, and restore our territorial integrity, and we are right. We are fighting on our soil; Armenia is fighting on the land of another country.

-How many military casualties have you sustained, sir?

-For military casualties, I already referred to that we will disclose this information after the clashes' active phase is over.

Do you intend to retake all of Nagorno-Karabakh, all disputed lands?

-We are talking about Nagorno-Karabakh and seven districts that surround the former Nagorno-Karabakh autonomous district. Because Armenia occupied Nagorno-Karabakh and expelled all Azerbaijanis, who were about 25 percent of the population of the autonomous district, and occupied seven districts of Azerbaijan with 700,000 people. Our main objective is to liberate those territories and allow Azerbaijani refugees and internally displaced persons to go back. As far as Nagorno-Karabakh is concerned, we think and that was officially declared many times that after the war is over, after occupational forces are withdrawn, Armenians and Azerbaijanis in Nagorno-Karabakh will live side-by-side as in any other country with a multi-ethnic population. One day, I am sure they will again become good neighbors to each other.

-The Armenian president told me that your demand that Armenia set a time-table for withdrawing troops should be put to the "Republic of Nagorno-Karabakh" because your dispute is with them. He added, though, that in Nagorno-Karabakh, 95 percent of the population were Armenians because they are living there for thousands of years. You say that Karabakh is Azerbaijan. But how would you address the fears of ethnic-Armenians there?

-First of all…

-Hold on, sir, that they might be ethnically cleansed if Azerbaijan retakes the territory.

-I understand that today in Azerbaijan, thousands of Armenians live in different cities of our country, primarily in Baku's capital city. One of the Armenian long-range destructive missiles, 'Smerch', which they use to attack our second largest city of Ganja, hit native Armenian women's house. So, today in Azerbaijan, there are thousands of Armenians who live in peace and dignity. But in Armenia, all Azerbaijanis have been expelled. Armenia's population is 99 percent Armenians. They committed ethnic cleansing against us. What the Armenian president said, he is lying again. Today it is not 95 percent, today it is 100 percent Armenians in Nagorno-Karabakh because 25 percent of Azerbaijanis who lived there were ethnically cleansed by the Armenian regime. I regret that such a person with such a vital position is spreading lies. Look on the internet, look at the Kurekchay Peace Agreement, which was signed at the beginning of the 19th century, between the Azerbaijani khan of Karabakh and the Russian general. Nothing is said about the Armenian population. Armenian population was resettled to our land by the Russian Empire to change the religious composition of the region after the Russo-Persian wars. It is a historical fact, and what the Armenian president says is fake, absolutely fake.

-I must point out that as you suggest that the Armenian president is spreading lies and fake information, so he has said the same thing about Azerbaijan and yourself.

-Look at the internet, look at the documents, and you will see who is telling the truth and who is lying.

-I have to make the point that each side is trading insults at this point. How would Azerbaijan accept international mediation and stop military action? What are your bottom lines here?

-We have international mediation for 28 years. OSCE Minsk Group is in "action", actually is the passive form for 28 years since 1992, and this mediation led to nothing. This mediation led to what is happening today. This mediation was not enough to press Armenia to leave the territories which do not belong to them.

-Have you been in touch with Washington on this? I mean, what is the Trump administration telling you? The US, of course, is one of the co-chairs of the Minsk Group.

-We have very diverse relations with the United States; connections are developing very successfully in many areas. As far as the Armenia-Azerbaijan Nagorno-Karabakh conflict is concerned, three countries of the Minsk Group co-chairs have the same right and the same responsibility to mediate. When representatives from these countries come, they come all together, representatives of three states. Therefore, there is no distinction in their performance. But of course, we understand that some countries are more pro-Armenian some countries are even more pro-Armenian.

-So, can I just ask you who are you speaking to in Washington? Is it the state, or is it the Trump administration? The Armenian president indeed told us that they have talked to Robert O'Brien, for example.

-Well, Armenian prime minister, I think the only person whom he did not speak during these days is the head of a tribe in some far away, remote island. He called everyone. He called President Putin five times, and he called President Macron, I don't remember four times. He called Chancellor Merkel. The only one left is a tribal chief. I advise to contact him and complain about Azerbaijan and send some people from his tribe to help poor, poor Armenia whom Azerbaijan is destroying.

-So, that wasn't the question, the question was, who are you speaking to in Washington? Is it the state, or is it the Trump administration?

-We speak with administration; we talk to the State Department. Actually, They contacted us. I gave our foreign ministry instructions to my administration to contact all those who call us, who want to express their position and express their view on how to move forward. It doesn't make any difference whether it is the State Department or White House because, for us, it is US Administration anyway.

-What's the position as you understand it in Washington?

-The position in Washington is not different from the part of other co-chairs. They are supporting the principles based on which the solution must be found. It is Armenia who is against those principles. Those principles say that territories surrounding Nagorno-Karabakh should be returned to Azerbaijan in time. When you were referring to my statement time-table, that is exactly what is in the documents. It is not me who invented them. It is Armenia who is against it.

-Let's look at Russia's position then, because it is not clear to me what Washington's position is from what we have just discussed. But let's have a look at Russia's role. Let me play out some sound from the Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov. He said we remain deeply concerned by the region's situation, and we believe that the sides must stop the fire and come to the negotiating table. They are asking that you go to the negotiating table. The Russian president has described the fighting as a tragedy. You spoke to Vladimir Putin, as I understand it, on Wednesday. What did he tell you? What are Russia's red lines here?

-I called President Putin to congratulate him on his birthday on the 7th of October. I do it every year, and so does he. So every year, we congratulate each other on our birthdays. And that was a coincidence that his birthday coincides with the events. Therefore, we discussed this issue, and our press service has issued a press release about that. It will not be right for me to say something more than it was released in the press.

-I wish you would, I mean, are you prepared to defy Moscow's appeal? For peace talks?

-We are for peace talks. If you allow me, I will just give you two examples. Azerbaijan is a constructive partner at to negotiation table. We think that the principles which have been elaborated by the United States, Russia, and France should be the basis for settlement. Armenian President rejects them; I am sorry, the Armenian prime minister rejects them. Because the person in charge of Armenia is not a president, but the prime minister, and with whom I had negotiations. So he said that "Karabakh is Armenia". That makes negotiations senseless. Because how can you say "Karabakh is Armenia" and negotiate to return the territories? He noted Azerbaijan should deal not with Armenia but with Nagorno-Karabakh, which is a change of format. So we are ready for negotiations if the Armenian prime minister returns from the skies where he is flying, back to earth.

-That is not the position, as I understand it, from the Russians who said both sides must stop the fire and come to the negotiating table.

-Those who started a fire should stop first, and we will do the same. But to go back to the negotiation table. Pashinyan regime did everything to destroy negotiations. They made the statement, and they attacked us in July, they attacked us in August, they attacked us in September. They do everything to disrupt negotiations. We are ready. But they are not.

If you won't stop, and they won't stop. What happens next? Where does this leave the conflict which so many people are now concerned could escalate into a much more comprehensive, regional war?

-It should not escalate wider; I call all the countries to stay away from this situation. It is our bilateral issue with Armenia. Mediators they have, they have their mandate. Their mandate is not to interfere on the ground; their mandate is to facilitate finding the solution. So, they will continue, I am sure, within the framework of their mandate. Armenians' attempt to make this conflict international is counter-productive, destructive, and dangerous for many countries. So, Armenia should understand that occupation cannot last forever. The status quo must be changed. And by the way, presidents, former presidents of France, former presidents of the United States, and President of Russia made a statement that the status quo is unacceptable and must be changed when all of them were in charge. I support it, but Armenia is against it.

-I want to get your response to a new report from Amnesty International claiming they have identified Israeli-made MO-95 DPICM cluster munitions. That appears to have been fired by Azerbaijani forces. Now CNN cannot independently verify those claims nor the apparent video of the explosions. But sir, how do you respond to Amnesty's requests?

-I would say that we don't have any contact with the organization you named because of their pro-Armenian and anti-Azerbaijani position. First, it is wrong. It is false, and second, I would recommend them to see how cluster bombs are being used against our civilians. How they use "Smerch", how they use "Elbrus", "Tochka U", ballistic missiles on our cities - Ganja, Goranboy, Naftalan, Yevlakh, and other cities are under Armenian bombardment. Why does Amnesty International see or want to see only one side? Why do they not see another side? That's a question.

-Let me just push you on this. Are you categorically saying that cluster munitions have not being used by Azerbaijani forces? And if so, are you prepared to allow independent observers to verify that?

-Yes, we are prepared to do it; also we are ready to see how Armenia will allow independent observers to see what they have been doing. And though it should be not unilateral, it should be bilateral. We defend ourselves, and we must do it. But our targets are only military objectives. And almost all of what we have destroyed, we destroyed from the very modern equipment. You can find it on the internet. It's Turkish brand new, excellent, marvelous fighter drones. It is other equipment which destroys you know tanks, guns, military positions. So we don't need to use these kinds of weapons to achieve our goal. Our targets are not civilians. Our target is occupants; we must return our land to those whom it belongs to.

-Sir, Armenia can and will speak for themselves. I am asking you; specifically, you categorically deny do you that the Azerbaijani forces have used cluster munitions.

-Yes, I deny it, and I want to ask you. Did you ask this question to the Armenian president?

-We didn't have the information at the time.

-That's the point; that's the point. You ask me, ask him, ask him. Let the Amnesty International ask him what they do.

-We will certainly ask him for a statement. I'm asking you.

-Ask him. I already answered. No. Ask him.

-I will. Thank you, sir.